WithSecure as an investment

I agree with @HerrDax and @G.J_Joe that a sale to a foreign owner might not be likely precisely because of R.S. However, if cybersecurity services are a growing area, an alliance between Nixu and F-Secure could work. It could become N-Secure or Fnixu :slight_smile:

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I wouldn’t think it matters whether the buyer is foreign or domestic. The world is already so globalized that cybersecurity expertise can come from any country. You’d think F-Secure’s major individual owners would also want growth for the company?

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Maybe not usually, but in this case, I was thinking that a merger might be easier mentally than a divestment, i.e., selling the company specifically to foreign ownership. I believe that if that were an option, RS would have already sold its share.

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A merger would almost forcefully mean that F-Secure would become the smaller party, so in practice, there wouldn’t be a big difference in how that deal would happen, right?

I wonder what caused F-Secure to drop almost -6% at the end of the day today, without any announcements?

Maybe it’s because the trading volume is less than 30,000 units, and someone decided to sell their shares at that price when another wanted to buy. With such a small volume, it’s enough if one person gives up at any price.

I went and ordered F-Secure’s Total package for two years since they were running a 50% discount campaign. It was easy to install on PC and Android with about two clicks (which is good for consumers). On iPhone, it was a bit more painful because the email didn’t display properly at first, and once I got my better half registered, it took so long for the download option to appear on the site that it became a bit frustrating. For PC and Android, I would give full marks for the installation; for iPhone, maybe 3.5/5. We’ll see how the VPN installs on MacBook.

However, 60€ for three users for two years is not a steep price, considering you get antivirus and a VPN. Now I can watch Finnish TV again.

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A small user experience update:

We ended up uninstalling it from the iPhone side, as it seems that F-Secure SAFE’s main functions, App Privacy and anti-virus, don’t work at all on the iPhone, because according to customer service, “Apple has strict security and app privacy can be done in iPhone settings.” So, it’s a rather useless app for iPhone, unless you absolutely want some abstract-sounding function like “safe browsing” (what does that even mean!?).

The customer service experience was quite good; it was even reasonably easy to communicate in real-time on a mobile phone. On the other hand, it was never made clear that F-Secure SAFE doesn’t have all the advertised features for iPhone, which is a big minus for F-Secure. Add to this that I bought this package at half price, it would be a bit steep to pay €120 for three users. F-Secure certainly has a lot to improve on with packages sold to consumers.

EDIT:

The experience on the Android side is good. Similarly, the VPN for Windows is good, although Amazon.com does recognize F-Secure’s VPN IP addresses, meaning you can’t watch Amazon Prime streams. Some other VPN providers are apparently able to change IP addresses so often that Amazon can’t keep up.

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It’s not all that surprising in itself. The operating system on iPhones is so closed that, in practice, antivirus programs cannot be implemented as separate applications, because even antivirus software cannot freely access the device’s files.

Usually, safe browsing and similar features mean that an add-on is installed in the browser that warns about malicious or otherwise suspicious sites. That’s actually quite a handy feature. Of course, whether one needs such a feature depends a lot on the user.

It’s true that F-Secure should somehow communicate this, if they’re not already doing so.

With F-Secure, the safe browsing feature can only be used if you use SAFE’s internal browser, which makes it a bit difficult.

As a softai, I myself returned to using Safe a couple of years ago and am otherwise satisfied, but the VPN frequently disconnected with US locations. Now it has improved after a complaint, but not completely resolved. I have win7/win10/iPhone/iPad and my wife has an Apple laptop. iOS is a Unix-based OS and doesn’t really need a virus scanner. For me, the VPN is the most essential part of it.

Just for clarification, I bought this Total package, which includes SAFE. Anyway, I mostly see the idea that a virus scanner isn’t needed on the Unix side as an illusion, especially since the Chinese web-based security flaw used to spy on Uyghurs on iPhones has been revealed. There are certainly vulnerabilities, but only the relative scarcity of Unix-based operating systems compared to Windows-based ones keeps the number of viruses and other security threats relatively smaller. Apple, however, probably has the advantage that programs can’t really be installed other than through the Apple store, and they won’t be accepted there without prior review.

The problem with this SAFE is that I don’t really see any major benefit in developing it for iPhone, but there are costs. They should at least sell just the Safe Browser program to those who need it.

Aren’t consumer products already doomed as a non-growth business for F-Secure, so there’s probably no point in investing too much in them on that basis.

I agree that consumer cybersecurity is a pretty challenging sector because nowadays, the trend is to have all important security features built into the operating system. Not long ago, for example, Windows’ built-in Defender antivirus was one of the worst in terms of virus detection, but recently it has been one of the best in tests. And it’s free. For instance, based on AV-Test’s latest tests (Test antivirus software for Windows 10 - June 2019 | AV-TEST), Windows Defender has received scores as good as F-Secure’s antivirus. In practice, there’s no need to install any antivirus software in addition to Windows Defender, unless you need F-Secure’s extra features, for example.

Then there’s also the increased use of Unix-based operating systems (Android, iOS, Chrome OS, various Linux distributions
). As @kelkka mentioned, the general idea is that these don’t need a virus scanner at all. Some, however, say that one should be acquired for Android. In the case of Android and iPhone, though, you’re unlikely to get viruses if you only use app stores to install applications.

The reason why other Unix operating systems don’t need virus scanners and similar software is indeed due to their low usage, but also the fragmentation of the operating system offerings. There are probably hundreds, if not more, Linux distributions, and viruses would have to be made separately for each. In addition, all Linux operating systems have package repositories similar to app stores, which, when used, practically prevent you from getting viruses on your computer. Using ready-made package repositories is also the only recommended way to install applications on Linux if you’re not sure what you’re doing. With Windows, programs are traditionally installed by downloading them from the internet, meaning you can’t know what you’re actually getting.

Security vulnerabilities, however, exist on all devices and operating systems, but no antivirus program helps with them. The only way to protect yourself from them is to remember to update software and the operating system often enough.

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Apparently, F-Secure made an agreement with Virgin Media at some point. Virgin Media offers F-Secure Safe for free for 12 months here in Britain, after which you have to pay for it. F-Secure has also come through at University College London – all university staff and students can download F-Secure Client Security Premium for free. Pretty good visibility in Britain, at least in my case.

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Hmm. The profit warning took 10% off this year’s profit, but the share price has now been reduced by 15% from around 3.39. A slight overreaction?

The stock market has never overreacted. Never. Don’t be silly :sweat_smile:

Perhaps there was an extra 5% of “let’s hope for a great future” on top of the share price, and in addition to the negative news, the wishful thinking fizzled out.

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Today, the share price seems to be rising quite well (+6.3% at the moment). What could be the reason for this?

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Getting the “security” right in good time for 5G


  • F-Secure’s Optim Advanced Security uses high-tech artificial intelligence and machine learning technology to create a secure home network. It protects homes and families from malicious websites, hacking, spyware, phishing, unprotected Internet devices, and other cyber security threats.

  • In addition to security services, the Optim Managed Assurance Platform offers a range of Wi-Fi management, self-service tools, big data analytics, speed checking tools, and much more. It provides service providers with a unified view of subscriber homes and real-time and historical visibility into Wi-Fi performance for fast and efficient troubleshooting


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Hey, this still isn’t taking off :unamused:

Hey, but it looks quite good in terms of improving profitability. Organic growth is certainly tough. New acquisitions on the way?