Talenom - Automated processes for greater efficiency

Okay, interesting!

I knew that Visma has bought all sorts of things for that financial administration “ecosystem” and around it, but this broader SaaS network (like Wilma) has certainly gone unnoticed by me. Partly because of that, I thought, would it really be interested in a competing system, when most of what I’ve seen has been supportive of its own ecosystem. Well, I don’t know, I’ll have to look into this whole thing more closely when time allows.

And apologies, here in Kainuu, F doesn’t come naturally to us :joy:

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Hello @Juha_Kinnunen

No worries :slight_smile:

Do you mean that Talenom would have enough resources to create its own organization for Easor + the necessary capital resources for growth? How do you see this spin-off happening on the stock exchange, and how would the organizations + balance sheet be divided? Currently, the leverage of just under 2.5 prevents inorganic growth through office acquisitions, and on top of this would come Easor’s growth investments + an annual dividend growing by 0.01 cents per share. The same problem would still exist, even if there were two separate companies, or how would additional capital suddenly appear other than through an issue? An issue would again be a poor option if the valuation is at this level. In this scenario, it would be difficult to see many more acquisitions if Easor is truly intended to be ramped up. Due to the “ramp-up,” it’s very difficult to see any other scenario than it ending up in the hands of a company in the field (Visma, Accountor, Fortnox…), which would be ready to take over directly + have the resources for expansion. On top of this, there would be higher administrative costs from two organizations.

One major problem with splitting is the sheer size. Even in the last couple of months, a large part of the trading volume has just been Danske’s block trades, and the rest of the volume has been very small. Even if the market values of the companies combined were to rise by, say, 50% in a dual-listing, we would still be at a 125-150m mcap. The market values + trading volume would remain far too small to attract foreign investors in particular. Nowadays, it seems that smaller growth companies are sold off by funds after reaching 200-250m€.

I personally see Easor’s exit as the only real value-enhancing option for shareholders and a realistic alternative. In this case, the sum of the parts is unlocked, and Talenom can implement what it was once good at and focus on it completely. Also, leverage would not be an issue for a while, and we could jump to the next level. Now there would be good resources for this, and acquisition targets would be found. Especially in Spain, there would be good potential for growth, and once the foundation in Sweden is in order, there too. I wouldn’t see any reason why the Tahkolas wouldn’t continue with this, and this would be the “we want to grow” that has been painted. Rantalainen has now done this and expanded to Norway in addition to Sweden. If Easor’s listing is decided upon, it’s up to the Tahkolas which one remains listed if the price is at this level. This brings up the Accountor case, where it’s easier to sell the companies separately, and traditional Talenom could also be taken out through a redemption. I personally don’t hope for this scenario.

To the previous question again :slight_smile:

How much do you see the depreciation + investments of the remaining operations in Talenom decreasing (if office acquisitions are not included in these)? These are now partly buried under Talenom’s operations and would transfer to Easor.
“Net investments for January 1 – June 30, 2025, totaled EUR 10.4 (13.1) million. Investments due to new customer agreements amounted to EUR 1.8 (1.8) million during the review period. Investments in software and digital services amounted to EUR 5.9 (7.9) million during the review period. Investments in own software decreased by approximately EUR 1.9 million compared to the reference period. Technology investments were directed at developing customer interfaces and further developing automation.”

I caught a news item about Fortnox that disappeared from my browser history. EQT had commented that the goal is international expansion, but not until 2027. I’ll post it here if it comes up again.

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Jutila’s titles seem to have suffered over the past few years when looking at the link. One can draw conclusions from this…

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If the purpose is only to separate software development expenses, then, for example, something like this can be found in Talenom’s 2024 annual report. When software development expenses are treated with 5-year straight-line depreciation, the annual figures then depend on historical (and partly future, of course) investments. In my opinion, investments are categorized relatively clearly in the reports.

I don’t know if this is partly a futile exercise, however, as Talenom already reports software business and service business separately in H1’25. So I would assume that those depreciations are itemized for the business operations in some justified way. Direct depreciations are not found, of course, but a good estimate for both business operations can probably be found between EBITDA and operating profit. There might be significant write-downs from customer accounts, especially in the accounting firm business, which could complicate things, but perhaps this is the best starting point at this stage?

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It remains to be seen how many customers will adopt the software that meets the criteria of the Verifactu legislation.

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Harri is excited too :wink: :slightly_smiling_face:

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Here are Juha’s comments on how Talenom has started distributing Easor to external agencies in Spain. :slight_smile:

Easor, the software business spun off from Talenom into a separate company at the beginning of 2025, has launched its software concept in Spain and started distributing it to accounting firms outside the group. Previously, the software was only used by Talenom itself. Spanish legislation will force companies to use Verifactu-supporting software for invoicing in January 2026, which means a huge number of companies are now looking for suitable software. Easor is now seeking customers through accounting firms, which would enable significant growth in recurring revenue in the long term.

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Talenom’s reporting very often involves hype about potential instead of news about actual successes.

On the other hand, I do understand that the company’s job is not to advertise that management sells shares, or if they don’t sell, then dividends are paid to top up their salary a bit, indebtedness grows, sales and product development are recorded on the balance sheet, and there might be a significant write-down risk in the Swedish business operations.

It will be interesting to see how right I am with my “analysis.”

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Here are Juha’s preliminary comments as the company releases its results on Friday. :slight_smile:
We expect the company to show slight revenue growth in Finland, double-digit growth in Spain, and a clear decline in revenue in Sweden. We expect the group’s profit to have remained stable compared to the reference period, with profit practically coming from Finland. In our opinion, there is downward pressure on the 2025 guidance, with the upper end of the guidance appearing unrealistic, but the company has the prerequisites to reach the lower end. The Q3 earnings release will focus particularly on Spain and the development of the software business based on recent news. Talenom plans to separate its software business Easor, and has just started distributing Easor to external accounting firms in Spain.

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[quote=“Sijoittaja-alokas, post:2616, topic:249”]just started Easor’s distribution to external accounting firms in Spain.

[/quote]

Somehow, this “distribution” gives the impression that customers just grab the offer like a free flyer.

The truth, however, is that the product is still completely unknown to potential customers. Instead of distribution, this requires hard sales work, which won’t yield results without time, money, expertise, and a good product.

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I noticed that the earnings release the day after tomorrow will also include the Chief Operating Officer and two country managers from Spain. A great opportunity to ask, among other things, how that hard sales work will be done in Spain and what expectations are appropriate to set there.

The English-language live webcast will be held on October 17, 2025, starting at 10:00 AM. In the broadcast, the company’s CEO Otto-Pekka Huhtala and CFO Matti Eilonen will present the main highlights of the review period. Additionally, the company’s Chief Operating Officer Juho Ahosola, as well as the Spain Country Manager for accounting firm business Lourdes Santisteban and the Country Manager for software business Anxo Barreiro, will discuss the strategies and market opportunities of the company’s business areas.

@Juha_Kinnunen, you most certainly already have Spain’s Easor sales work and market potential highlighted with a big marker on your interview question list, but I’m still reminding you that this topic is also eagerly awaited by those watching.

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Here it is available again, Q3-2025:

In comparable key figures, a one-time increase of EUR 1.5 million resulting from a change in the revenue recognition principle has been deducted from the January-September net sales. In addition, a net expense of EUR 0.2 million related to additional purchase prices for acquisitions and EUR 1.8 million in revenue recognition from the comparison period have been deducted from the January-September operating profit and EBIT.

In September, we announced that we are initiating a strategic evaluation of the potential separation of the Easor software business into an independent publicly listed company. We appointed Juho Ahosola (M.Sc. (Econ.), HTM, eMBA b.1988), who has long been a member of the management team, as Deputy CEO, responsible for the accounting firm business. This enables the Group’s CEO to increasingly focus on the separation and management of the software business.

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Guidance remains unchanged at this stage:

Guidance for 2025 unchanged

Talenom estimates its 2025 revenue to be approximately 130–140 million euros and its operating profit (EBITDA) to be approximately 36–42 million euros.



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Finland’s revenue and profit are growing, so it can then make losses abroad. Sweden is plummeting quite seriously. Spain and Italy are accumulating losses. Customer numbers have indeed developed well (apologies for the wrong observation earlier).

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Wait a minute, have I now missed something about Easor’s leadership? When the spin-off of the software business was first announced on 9.10.2024, the company stated “We plan to separate the software business into its own company, and we will start offering our software to other accounting firms and their clients. An expert in international software business will be recruited to lead the company, and until then, the unit will be led by Talenom’s Deputy CEO Antti Aho.”

Is this “expert in international software business” now Otto-Pekka Huhtala? Tell me I’ve misunderstood and the recruitment is still ongoing.

PS. With a sense of trepidation, I await how this international SaaS expert’s language skills have developed over the past few years.

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Hi!

Which report shows the development of the customer count? I only found the software side, and not even there a significant decrease.

I couldn’t find only service customers, but it was naturally said that it’s still decreasing in Sweden (which can also be seen from the revenue). I’m genuinely asking, as the information would naturally be of interest. Well, these were probably last discussed in a presentation that apparently hasn’t been published yet.

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You haven’t missed it, you’re on the pulse of the times. It seems that Otto-Pekka is joining Easor as paths diverge. Ahosola new CEO for Talenom? This is just speculation in light of current information and what has been said.

I won’t comment on expertise in international software business, but either such expertise wasn’t found, or such an arrangement was desired for one reason or another.

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There is still some way to go to reach the midpoint of the full-year guidance. Last year, however, Q4 EBITDA% was particularly weak. If the revenue target is met, the EBITDA% achieved in Q1-Q3 will be well sufficient.

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Surely, top-tier SaaS experts could have been found

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Certainly there would have been, if they had been willing to invest enough money and remove the main owner’s relative from management. It’s good to understand the background of the decision-making. I am pleased with the appointment of the Deputy CEO